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16  Welcome to Fudzilla Forum / Discussion about Articles / Re: Voting poll: Do you think that the CPU is more important than the GPU? Say y on: April 12, 2008, 07:06:11 AM
If you ask me, both sides are acting like a bunch of capricious kids, running around, yelling, beating each other silly and spreading the sour smell of FUD all over the place.

I can understand Intel (to some extent), but Nvidia ?! What the hell were they thinking ? At least Intel has some "graphics" of its own (IGPs and a discrete solution on the way), but what does Nvidia have on to hope for on the CPU side ?

For my line of work, the CPU is much more important (3D, video). Not to dismiss the relevance of graphics in the equation, but you just can't compare the two. What about the "silent majority", people who don't play games, or better yet people who don't do anything demanding on their machines ? An Intel IGP is great as far as they're concerned. Not sure they would enjoy working on a machine with no CPU and a 9800GX2 though...
you're getting it wrong , i were a nVIDIA fan since my old and beloved TNT till the 7th series of Geforce i didn't liked they're marketing startegy and rebranding and so on so i left nvidia camp for ATI lol, but i like the nVIDIA point of view , what nVIDIA says is quite logical ,if you go from an Intel E8500 to 2 * QX9770 which will cost you about 15 times more Smiley , you won't even gain twice the performance in games , but if you go from an Intel G33 to even the cheapest nVIDIA or ATI graphics which is 8400 GS/ 2400 pro you'll end up paying three times the money and gaining at least 5 times in performance it's quite logical , the price of CPU's doesn't scale logically , there shouldn't be so much differ in price of two identical processor with difference in just i don't know 333 MHz clock pulse , for instance the differ between Q6600 and QX6800 , for 600 MHz you have to pay four times the price , and gain less than 25% boost in speed , in graphics card market it's not like that , you pay 130 $ for 9600, when you're paying about 250-60 $ for 8800 GTS you'll pay about 200% the price but at least you're gaining 50% more performance , i believe those Extreme edition processors are bullshit !!! , i remember the nice days of gold fingers , intel FCPGA Celerons AMD thunderbirds , XP's and even mighty Opteron 144 ,146 processors , ATI X800 Pro and so on , those days were days of overclocking not now , the terms of overclocking was to buy cheap components and squeeze them as much as you can , now a days they're just telling you , common buy this CPU for 3 times of the price that it worth , we've underclocked it !!!
you can increase the clock speed by just clicking on a button on you're mouse , no skill required , all you need is just to buy a book which is called overclocking for dummies !!!!
you can overclock this processor at least by one gigahertz !!! , you've got the money , so common !!!
at least nVIDIA/DAAMIT are not underclocking their own GPGPU's more over i was just reading this article :" http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/36436/118/1/1/ " and Sweeney just mentioned some interesting idea's (i don't remember in which part) , he predicted that we might someday see a running linux kernel on NVIDIA GPU .
there are two things which i don't understand: the first is why nVIDIA's losing it's value while it have launched so many successful products lately , and secondly , why DAAMIT's not backing up nVIDIA anymore .
anyhow , i believe nVIDIA's right , all Intel's doing is to put more transistors (in form of cache or more cores) on it's CPU's and call it innovation !!! while application's aren't ready for that sort of multi-threading they're  not improving IPC/Performance/GHz ratio at all , i believe that the future lies in hands of GPGPU , I hope Intel's wrong , just like it was wrong with netburst , and tried to prove to people that more GHz means more performance !!! i believe multi-core war will get an end soon !!!
17  Hardware / Graphics Cards / Re: AMD Unveiled April Fools' Surprises on: April 04, 2008, 07:14:19 AM
In a recent visit to the ATI Vendor IDs page (http://ati.amd.com/developer/vendorid.html), AMD listed out the complete listing of its Mobility Radeon HD 3000 series lineup, of which a few items stood out to my eyes.

ProductCoreDevice ID
ATI Mobility ATI Radeon™ HD 3400 SeriesM7295C4
ATI Mobility ATI Radeon™ HD 3430M7295C2
ATI Mobility ATI Radeon™ HD 3650M769591
ATI Mobility ATI Radeon™ HD 3850M769504
ATI Mobility ATI Radeon™ HD 3850 X2M769506
ATI Mobility ATI Radeon™ HD 3870M769508
ATI Mobility ATI Radeon™ HD 3870 X2M769509

Could that be some kind of surprise or they are just April fools' joke?
If not does that mean that the Mobility Radeon HD 3000 series graphics cards are capable of CrossFire X? We saw the ASUS "Trinity", a truly monsterous product prototype, and I hope that these Mobility X2s will be some great weapons to help AMD/ATI to gain back the mobile market.

P.S. The attachment is an ATI Device ID file obtained from ATI website on April 1st, 2008.
turned out , it wasn't a joke after all Smiley
http://www.computerbase.de/news/hardware/grafikkarten/ati/2008/april/ati_mobility_radeon_hd_3870_x2/
18  Hardware / Graphics Cards / Re: A hot Nvidia card pictured on: April 01, 2008, 07:56:54 PM
they never said it was new they just said expensive
i agree Smiley
19  Hardware / Graphics Cards / Re: A hot Nvidia card pictured on: April 01, 2008, 07:56:25 PM
i believe it's 5800 Ultra , but I'm not sure ,
moreover all fudo have written were true , it cost more than G92 but I'm not sure it costs more than GT200 , it is also so hot that nVidia took it out of the market before even shipping it Smiley
nice 13 bedar lie (it's the persian version of april's fools day )
20  Welcome to Fudzilla Forum / Discussion about Articles / April fools day :) on: April 01, 2008, 07:52:24 PM
your lies are so big , that they're rather unbelievable , no one will believe apple ever migrating to windows or nVidia making a high AGP card , without even two DVIs Cheesy
is it 5800 Ultra ??
21  Hardware / Graphics Cards / Re: AMD Unveiled April Fools' Surprises on: April 01, 2008, 02:11:39 PM
if it's not a lie , that would be great , w00t ^_^
22  Hardware / Graphics Cards / Re: Which card to get. on: March 30, 2008, 05:02:32 PM
generaly 7950GT is faster than 1950pro , (i know about 36 pixel shaders and 24 )
but i know that you're an ATI guy , so go for ATI .
i learned over time , whatever you  believe in , you'll like more !!
that may sound stupid , but it's real Smiley
moreover there's no much difference between these two specific cards Smiley
23  Hardware / Graphics Cards / Re: ABIT Joins Nvidia camp, Now Selling Graphics Cards on: March 30, 2008, 02:56:37 PM
i don't really know why abit left nVIDIA camp in the first place , i mean after FX generation of GeForce
24  Hardware / Graphics Cards / Re: Which card to get. on: March 28, 2008, 07:02:22 AM
2*x1950pro?
What do you mean.

i mean what i mean go for CF Wink
25  Hardware / Processors - CPU / Re: phenom 9600@3258 mhz on: March 28, 2008, 06:55:44 AM
anybenchs Huh!!!
26  Hardware / Graphics Cards / Re: Which card to get. on: March 27, 2008, 07:09:54 AM
I believe that 7950GT will outperform 1950 Pro , but I'm not sure about CNC and call of duty
in general even 7900GT outperforms 1950pro by few percents on the other hand 1950 pro supports HDR and Antialising together while 7 series doesn't.
go for 2*1950 pro Smiley
27  Hardware / Others / Re: "iPhone 3" to use Intel's x86 Atom Processor? on: March 20, 2008, 09:41:52 PM
I don't agree with you at all !!!
M$ is making the worst OS ever made , they see the issues and what will they do Huh
they won't reconstruct their OS , Why Huh Compatibility with older apps , what's the cost Huh
larger and larger windoze !! which is a memory hog which is slower than ever , they also do some innovations !!!
The windoze is JUST GUI based so look at their new windows 2008 Server Core , and you'll understand what I'm saying , apple saw the flaws in their own OS 9 Series so they've sacrificed compatibility and moved to Darwin core which is technically is a unixoid (it is based on FreeBSD 5) . moreover they understood the Gigahertz fever and moved to Intel although they've made PowerPC alliance . so they're not comparable to M$ .
the only reason that we're still stick to old and inefficient x86 CISC architecture is because of the M$ .
everyone knows that RISC architecture is more efficient than modest CISC architectures as you can see IBM Cell processors have got more processing power than even intel core micro architecture . moreover if you compare old mac G5s (which are at least 5 years older than Core2s) they are even competitive in the same clock .
the only reason that mac won't release OSX for standalone installation is just because of the support , I mean hardware support . the same situation that we're encountering in Linux .
VGA drivers are not mature , for example Geforce 2 Pro outperforms 7300GT & Radeon X1300 .
after 5 years you can't install Xfi drivers on linux easily ( although they've released a driver which you need to recompile the kernel from slab to slub and still it's not working properly)
and so on . so if Apple release it's OSX to market no one will be satisfied .

and about the iPhone , I wanted to buy a cellphone , so I looked around and found a couple of cellphone with 380 MHz ARM processors or 200 MHz version from either Nokia & SonyEricsson but they've performed so slow that i didn't wanted to even look at them i have to add that they're all using well known Symbian OS , more over mp3 playback was so poor that i didn't wanted to even listen to anykind of music keep in mind that for example Nokia N81 8GB or 5700 Speciality's are in music I even tried Sennheiser CX300 in earphone's and my own HD595 Headset with them , but when i touched iPhone i fell in love with it , it is as expensive as N81 (so it's not that expensive) it's music playback quality is superior to every cellphone it also is sleek and toooooo fast for a cellphone so why should I be stupid to buy one Huh
the only drawback is that it's not 3G and the bluetooth thing , which I can deal with 'em .

about Atom I agree with you , basically x86 isn't a good option for portable devices .

You don't have to agree with me Smiley

The slow-ness comes from the OS involved, and Apple is doing nothing else as creating a GUI as M$ does. Apple took BSD which is similar to Linux and put a new GUI on it. If you have read about the iPhone SDK this is worse compared to M$. You are allowed to use it, but you can sell your stuff only via iTunes, you have to pay Apple 30% and only Apple decides if the application is worth for downloading - welcome to Cuba. Sorry, Apple is doing the monopolist things and I will not support such a company - so be sure - I will never buy any Apple product, because they are just cheapo toys with clever marketing and bad customer support. If you fall for it - your problem. My phone has to do one thing: It should phone. I don't need cameras, I don't need interweb, I don't need any other gimmicks. I want a PHONE. For my music I own a mediaplayer (with Rockbox (.org) on it, so I can play any other format besides .mp3 - which will also work on Apple iPods Cheesy - and has tons of options no player actually has). If I want to make good pictures, I will buy a camera. So be happy with your iPhone, pay ridiculous provider fees - I don't care, but don't come whining when in some near future Apple owns you.


best,

Eliot

I don't support any companies policy , whether it is apple or M$ , but personally i hate M$ .
moreover i were not aware of apples such policy , it's just stupid !!!
moreover where do you think i live Huh , I haven't paid ridiculous prices for iPhone , I've paid something like 500 bucks , but because of unavailability i sold my phone for about 700 bucks lol Cheesy . moreover there are no provider in iran who supports iphone , so it was some sort of unlocked version .
after all i mostly agree with you about owning mp3 player and camera instead of having phone and such sort of things , i love my own old A95 a lot more than any phone camera on the market .
28  Hardware / Processors - CPU / Re: Phenom Triple Core B3 on: March 17, 2008, 02:26:21 PM
QUESTION,
    What do you do with a defective Phenom Quad Core CPU?


ANSWER,
    You disable one or two of the defective cores and sell it as a Triple Core, or Dual Core Phenom CPU!

Will it work on older motherboards?
     possibly, if you update the BIOS, but why bother?  In all probability the older motherboard will not be PCIE 2.0 compliant, and still be limited to a maximum of DDR2 800 MHz memory!

Multiple CPU's, or multicore CPU's are primarily for multitasking!  That is like walking and chewing gum at the same time!  And there are still limits to how much bubble gum you can chew at any one time!

I have an ASUS M3A-32 MVP wifi Motherboard, with 4 GB of DDR2 1066 RAM and I replaced my Phenom 9600 Quad Core CPU with a dual core Athlon 64 6400+ BE CPU overclocked to 3.5 GHz, along with a Radeon HD 3870 video card!  Even though the CPU only recognizes the memory as being DDR2 800MHz, I have not noticed and difference in my 2D applications, or the number of applications that I can run at once, But I have certainly noticed a significant difference in my 3D games!

My recommendation would be to save your money and buy a motherboard that is a little more futureproof, and then put a CPU in it that operates faster than 2.3 GHz!  3 cores might be better than 2 cores, but 4 GHz is a whole lot better than 2.3 GHz!



I'll replace my X2 which is working at 2.6 GHz with a 2.2-2.3 GHz phenom processor as soon as the kernel panic fixes , if you want to play games you it's not necessary at all to go Quad , makes no differ whether it's phenom or C2Q , but i'm sure that i can put the 3rd and 4th cores of phenom in to good use Smiley
29  Hardware / Power Supply - PSU / Re: Dell PSU on: March 16, 2008, 07:55:18 AM
SO im lost my psu max is 264watts? wth. Its supposed to be underrated.

Sorry for late reply, have some stuff to test  Cheesy

There are peak specs and continous specs. It depands what your PSU is specified.
Most of the time it goes like: you can do 600W, when you do 180W on 3.3+5V and 410W for the 12A rails.
So, 10W are left for +5Vusb.
The 12A rails would be rated as 22A per rail, two rails = 2x 22A = 528W... but you can do the 528W only, if your mainboard does not use more than 62W on the +3.3V & +5V rail which is of course not working. So don't get confused with the specs on your PSU. It's not that easy. Of course 12V rails also means they count CPU in.

Peak vs. Continuous:
Every PSU can sustain higher amps for a short time, mostly about 30 seconds. If this time is exceeded the PSU will shut down. Continuous means the PSU can hold the specified output always.

Your PSU is rated 264W for the 12V rail(s) only. You can make a picture of the label with the specifications on your PSU and I can tell you more about your PSU.

Here an example of the Seasonic S12II 330W:

+3.3V: 18A
+5V:    20A
combined power: +3.3V & +5V: 120W
+12V1: 17A
+12V2: 17A
combined power: 12V: 288W
-12V: 0.8A
+5Vsb: 2.5A

So, 288+120 can not work... because the PSU is rated with 330W
Also 3.3V x 18A = 59.4W, 5V x 20A = 100W, total is 159.4W does not work either.
So it can use max. 18A on 3.3V but not at the same time 20A for +5V, the maximum in this case would be 12A for +5V.
If your board/equipment is using 120W on the +3.3V & +5V you can't use 288W for 12V... I guess this can only be happen on crappy ASRock boards where no ATX 2.x power connector is used. +5Vsb rated 12.5W is used for USB devices when the computer is off, so it does not count in the active state.
Have no idea what equipment is using the -12V, but it's reserved when the computer is running.
Totally you have about 320W to use.

A harddisc is using about 0.5A for 12V and about 0.8A for 5V
A mainboard is more complicated, the voltage for the memory can be generated from 3.3V, 5V or 12V rails, this is up to the engineers, but like the CPU 12V is the best guess, because it is more efficient. 1GB stick is about 4W, overclocking is increasing it. Most chipset/onboard chips are running with either 3.3V or 5V. A board should use about 30W.

So you can do some calculations yourself Wink


best,

Eliot
thanks for your explaination but i wonder whether my PSU can ever deliver it's nominal 4*18AMPs or not  Huh
30  Hardware / Processors - CPU / Re: Phenom Triple Core B3 on: March 14, 2008, 04:54:30 PM
technically K10 scales much better than intel Core architecture , so it's just matter of clock pulse , moreover intel can't make 3 core processors , so time will tell what will happen Smiley .
if AMD manage to reach at least 2.6 GHz , it would be the best processor to buy Smiley
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